If Some Person Standing On A Street Corner Asks You For Change Would You Help?
GamingMaiden
This is my favorite forum on the Citadel.
Jack said:
QFT.SpartanEvolved said:
M
MR.KAZ
Lurker
Hi Everyone!!GamingMaiden said:
Nice to see members active.Please don't take this the wrong way but isn't there a little room for compassion here?A disease is anything that does constant negative things to your body.Speaking from experience,it's not so simple to say that I'm going to quit once and for all.That is the whole essence of addiction.Sure some people have the force of will to quit cold turkey,never to pick up a bottle again,but they are part of an elite group.I struggled for years,relapsing and disappointing myself and the ones I love dearly.A lot of people aren't as fortunate enough as I was to have loved ones supporting me through thick and thin.If you have never been addicted to something,you cannot comprehend how truly dire the situation is.
Godspeed.
Kaz
creepindeth04
Moderator
MR.KAZ said:
Nobody is arguing that Alcoholism is bad. Just the definition of "disease."
My biggest gripe with regards to the disease thing is, why does it seem to only apply to alcoholism? Why do alcoholics get the luxury of masking their addiction as a "disease" where as, a heroin addict is a junky, a crack addict is a basehead, a weed addict is a doper, and so on,. It seems to me that since those substances are illegal, the users get a much more derogatory label. I think that is unfair because they are no different, they are all addictions brought on by abuse of a substance, none of them are a disease like cancer that just happens, no matter how healthy you are.
My compassion for alcoholics is minimal. They kill innocent people everyday with drunk driving and they are abusive to the people they should be protecting. If you find yourself drunk driving or abusing your family, you stop drinking! Nothing in this world is easy, but there's just no excuse to keep living like that. It's no different than being overweight, smoking, etc,. Changing habits is extremely hard, I know, I smoked heavily for about 8 years. I honestly believe anybody can change, they just have to actually want to change, and do what's needed to change. Most abusers I know say they want to change, yet they are stubborn and never actually follow through with the steps involved to change, which leads me to have minimal compassion. I hope I do not offend anybody with what I just wrote.
EDIT: Understood, Grind. I have said my piece on this matter.
My compassion for alcoholics is minimal. They kill innocent people everyday with drunk driving and they are abusive to the people they should be protecting. If you find yourself drunk driving or abusing your family, you stop drinking! Nothing in this world is easy, but there's just no excuse to keep living like that. It's no different than being overweight, smoking, etc,. Changing habits is extremely hard, I know, I smoked heavily for about 8 years. I honestly believe anybody can change, they just have to actually want to change, and do what's needed to change. Most abusers I know say they want to change, yet they are stubborn and never actually follow through with the steps involved to change, which leads me to have minimal compassion. I hope I do not offend anybody with what I just wrote.
EDIT: Understood, Grind. I have said my piece on this matter.
GamingMaiden
This is my favorite forum on the Citadel.
That is sad. However, I just can't find any compassion for those who would've found a chance to change things around but didn't. It's their life, so be it. I don't pity them. They shouldn't shame themselves by begging. They should have the will to make the change instead of asking for it. That's all I'm saying. (Talking about the homeless here.)MR.KAZ said:
Grindspine
Moderator
[quote author=Mirriam Webster]
Main Entry: dis·ease
Pronunciation: \di-ˈzēz\
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English disese, from Anglo-French desease, desaise, from des- dis- + eise ease
Date: 14th century
1 obsolete : trouble
2 : a condition of the living animal or plant body or of one of its parts that impairs normal functioning and is typically manifested by distinguishing signs and symptoms : sickness, malady
3 : a harmful development (as in a social institution)
— dis·eased \-ˈzēzd\ adjective
[/quote]
Ok, if people are going to debate about definitions, above are the Mirriam Webster definitions of disease and alcoholism.
Now, having worked in a CHEMICAL DEPENDENCY behavioral health unit and having worked in a hospital lab and having studied infectious diseases, I do not personally consider alcoholism to be a disease. It is a behavior. It could be argued that it is a condition. One could even argue that since the World Health Organization keeps alcoholism statitistics that it is a health problem.
But again, I worked at a BEHAVIORAL HEALTH unit dealing with CHEMICAL DEPENDENCY, so will go back to calling it a maladaptive behavior.
So, unless any of you have more experience in health and disease than I do, let's move the topic back to those asking for change. Whom, I might mention, are not all alcoholics, nor are all homeless.
Main Entry: dis·ease
Pronunciation: \di-ˈzēz\
Function: noun
Etymology: Middle English disese, from Anglo-French desease, desaise, from des- dis- + eise ease
Date: 14th century
1 obsolete : trouble
2 : a condition of the living animal or plant body or of one of its parts that impairs normal functioning and is typically manifested by distinguishing signs and symptoms : sickness, malady
3 : a harmful development (as in a social institution)
— dis·eased \-ˈzēzd\ adjective
[/quote]
Ok, if people are going to debate about definitions, above are the Mirriam Webster definitions of disease and alcoholism.
Now, having worked in a CHEMICAL DEPENDENCY behavioral health unit and having worked in a hospital lab and having studied infectious diseases, I do not personally consider alcoholism to be a disease. It is a behavior. It could be argued that it is a condition. One could even argue that since the World Health Organization keeps alcoholism statitistics that it is a health problem.
But again, I worked at a BEHAVIORAL HEALTH unit dealing with CHEMICAL DEPENDENCY, so will go back to calling it a maladaptive behavior.
So, unless any of you have more experience in health and disease than I do, let's move the topic back to those asking for change. Whom, I might mention, are not all alcoholics, nor are all homeless.
M
MR.KAZ
Lurker
With all due respect to your training Grindspine,which I respect,unless you are an alcoholic you have absolutely no idea what it feels like.A dictionary's definition of a disease hardly scratches the surface.
ThravRande
Darth Revan is watching you.
Question- Were you an alcoholic?MR.KAZ said:
M
MR.KAZ
Lurker
Up until about 10 or 11 years ago I was a full blown drunk.It's not something I'm proud of, but when I didn't have money to buy alcohol I either stole things to sell or resorted to mouthwash and vanilla.I know from experience.Not a day goes by that I don't think about picking up a bottle.To be honest I'm deathly afraid to.ThravRande said:
ThravRande
Darth Revan is watching you.
well, I'm glad to hear you know what you're talking about.MR.KAZ said:
Too many times I hear people defending things they have hardly any knowledge of. :-\
But anyway, the way i see it, they got theirselves into the mess, they oughta be the ones to get out of it.
Like my good friend's dad said when my friend got a speeding ticket. "I didn't help you get the ticket, I'm not helping you out at court."
Re: If Some Person Standing On A Street Corner Asks You For Change Would You Hel
Don't ever even take a sip, KAZ! I am the same way with cig's. I know for a fact that if I even took one puff I would be a full blown smoker again. It's a struggle everyday since family members and friends smoke, but I won't ever go back to it.
Don't ever even take a sip, KAZ! I am the same way with cig's. I know for a fact that if I even took one puff I would be a full blown smoker again. It's a struggle everyday since family members and friends smoke, but I won't ever go back to it.
M
MR.KAZ
Lurker
Re: If Some Person Standing On A Street Corner Asks You For Change Would You Hel
Yes,exactly.x2 said:
Grindspine
Moderator
MR.KAZ said:
With all due respect, when you see the same people making the same mistakes then blaming it on a "disease" instead of taking responsibility for their lives, you no longer see it the same way.
We're going to have to agree to disagree on the matter.
But as I said, let's get this conversation back to spare change instead of opinions on alcoholism.
M
MR.KAZ
Lurker
Sounds good Grindspine!Grindspine said:
